[mei-neumes-ig] MEI Neumes Module Draft, Version 0.2

[Elaine Stratton Hild]

Dear Stefan and all,


 


Thank you so much for the message and feedback.


 


Yes, for the encoding, I think the terms from the 10th
century Anonymous Vaticanus will work better than neume names, for several
reasons:



* the author of the treatise already did some of the
abstraction work that we also need to do, in order to encode: he describes the
component elements of the notational signs and their basic meanings
* his terms are contemporary with the earliest notation,
unlike the neume names, which first appear in the 12th century
* his terms can be used with all neumatic notation (unlike the
neume names, which only describe a limited selection of notational signs)











Thank you also for suggesting other interpretations (and
adjectives to use for the attribute values) of the episema and tractulus. Your
point shows the importance of being able to encode the visual domain (the
presence of an episema, for example) 
separately from the logical domain (the meaning a musicologist
associates with the episema). 


 


To what extent should we try to standardize these interpretations
of notation in the encoding’s logical domain? In other words, does the MEI
Special Interest Neumes Group need to decide now on the logical domain, the
scribe’s meaning, of an episema? If we answer yes, I’m afraid this could slow
down or stall the process of revising the module, because we would need to
agree not only on episema, but also on significative letters and angular
modifications for multiple individual signs… And would it keep other
musicologists from wanting to use the module if the more subjective layers of
performance information were automatically associated with the encoding of the more-easily-agreed-upon
visual domain? 


 


Thomas Weber and I were thinking that it would be good to allow
the option of recording only the basic signs and the basic information
concerning their connections and relative pitch (or absolute pitch, if a staff
is involved). And then, each musicologist could decide on how much of the
nuanced performance information to include in the logical domain of the
encoding. 


 


What if one musicologist understood an angled pes to
indicate a longer duration of the first note, and another musicologist
understood it to indicate a heavier, or more emphasized performance of the
first note, and another musicologist might want neither such interpretation to
be included? Knowing that musicologists will have slightly different
interpretations—with good reasons!—and that even the same musicologist might
choose a slightly different interpretation, depending on the repertory and the
scribe, maybe it’s best to allow multiple options for the attribute values in
the logical domain of the episema and angular modifications.  


 


For significative letters “c” and “t” it will be easier,
perhaps? Could we just use English translations of the Latin words?


 


I think that such level of detail—the nuanced performance
information that may or may not be present in neumatic notation—should be
optional in our encoding. It seems important to remember that the absence of an
element, like an episema, does not carry the same information as its presence.
In other words, if a scribe wrote an acuta with episema, he was indicating
something different about its performance—longer, or heavier—but an acuta
without an episema is usually ambiguous. The acuta might have had a “normal”
performance, or it might have had a longer, or heavier performance. We don’t
usually know. In many instances, it could just be that the scribe was using a
less-detailed type of notation. Just as the scribes didn’t always want to
“encode” down to a detailed level, we should allow ourselves the flexibility of
encoding differing levels of details.  


 


I’ll look forward to hearing what you all think.


 


Many thanks and all best wishes,


Elaine
   





Julius-Maximilians-Universität Würzburg
Institut für Musikforschung
Domerschulstraße 13
D-97070 Würzburg





>>> "Prof. Dr. Morent" <stefan.morent at uni-tuebingen.de> 09/22/17 12:57 PM >>>
  I would agree with the idea to encode the logical concept behind neume signs, considering the individual visual
appearance as a "font" used by scribes within various traditions over time and space and within these traditions to
express individual meaning.
 
 Even if "producta" sounds probably unfamiliar to most chant scholars as to now it has the advantage to have a
historical-theoretical background compared to the (modern invention) "tractulus".
 
 I would however be cautious with terms like "longer", "duration" ... perhaps something like "light"/"heavy", "more
emphasized", "strong" ... would be more appropriate?
 
 best Stefan
 
 ----- Nachricht von Elaine Stratton Hild <elaine.stratton_hild at uni-wuerzburg.de> ---------
      Datum: Thu, 21 Sep 2017 14:05:37 +0200
        Von: Elaine Stratton Hild <elaine.stratton_hild at uni-wuerzburg.de>
 Antwort an: Neumes Interest Group of the Music Encoding Initiative <mei-neumes-ig at lists.uni-paderborn.de>
    Betreff: Re: [mei-neumes-ig] MEI Neumes Module Draft, Version 0.2
         An: mei-neumes-ig at lists.uni-paderborn.de
    Thanks so much for your time, Andrew (and all!).  My answers are below, marked with *. 
 
  All best wishes,
  Elaine
 

 
 
    
   
   
  Dr. Elaine Stratton Hild
  Corpus monodicum: Die einstimmige Musik des lateinischen Mittelalters    
   Julius-Maximilians-Universität Würzburg
 Institut für Musikforschung
 Domerschulstraße 13
 D-97070 Würzburg   
   
 
 
 >>> Andrew Hankinson <andrew.hankinson at mail.mcgill.ca> 09/20/17 9:24 PM >>>
 Thank you, Elaine! This clarifies a few things.
 
 "Shape" is a term I borrowed from the process of data modelling to mean two objects which share the same properties and
values, but which may be completely different instances of something. Two houses with one door and 10 windows could be
said to have the same 'data shape', and it doesn't matter if one is a bungalow and one a skinny three-story Dutch house,
and one is called a 'house' and another a 'huis'.
 
 In this case, it simply means that two things that have a pitch contour of "up-then-down," for example, must be
instances of the same class of things regardless of any particular name or identifier attached to them. The thing is
defined by its properties, and not by a name that is given to it.
   
  ***Thank you for the explanation!
 
 Perhaps you could clarify a few things about the functioning of your proposed elements. It seems that there are
properties of these symbols that are non-exclusive, and that a single symbol can carry with it multiple dimensions of
description.
 
 As an encoder, when would I choose to use a 'gravis' over a 'puncta' if they can both mean 'lower' pitch? 
   
  ***These terms refer to different signs, different visual forms on the page. A gravis looks different than a punctus.
(Gravis looks like \ while punctus looks like a period . In O splendidissima, the first notational sign above the
syllable "splen" is an acuta connected to a gravis; two punctus are visible above the syllable "di")  A musicologist
encoding the notation can record the basic visual forms with the terms gravis, acuta, punctus, producta. The meanings of
these signs will need to encoded separately, because the meanings depend, to some extent, on context of the surrounding
signs (which a musicologist can interpret). A punctus can mean "lower than preceding pitch" or it could also be slightly
more ambiguous--it could mean "same or lower than the preceding pitch." 
   
   I understand that only puncta can be 'same or lower' but it seems, on the face of it, that there might be some
confusion about when to use each. It also seems like there are three signs available to encode the 'same' pitch, two for
'lower', and only one for 'higher.' 
   
  ***When choosing which basic sign to encode, the musicologist wiright, different signs were used to convey the same information about pitch content. Conveying information about pitch
content was not the only (or even the most important) aspect of notation for many medieval scribes. They used different
forms to show different aspects of performance, and that's why it's important for us to be able to encode both the
graphic signs (the visual domain) as well as the meanings we can glean from the scribe's use of the signs (the logical
domain).  Returning to O splendidissima, the "lower" pitches the scribe wrote with punctus were probably performed
shorter, or "lighter" than the the "lower" pitch recorded with the gravis. A musicologist should be able to add as much
of this nuanced performance information that she wants, depending on her understanding of the notation and her desire
for detail.
   
   Will this cover the range of pitch movements necessary in the repertoires?
   
  ***We need the options of neutral (or unknown), same, lower, same or lower, higher, same or higher. In some cases, a
scribe will modify a sign to give additional information concerning pitch content. For instance, a scribe sometimes
wrote a gravis longer, visually--extending down further than usual. (The gravis over "splen" happens to be one example.)
The information about melodic interval is still "lower than previous pitch", but the musicologist might want to record
the additional visual information (extended) and also record the meaning she attributes to the scribe's modification
("lower than the previous pitch by a third or more").  (In the case of O splendidissima, because the scribe used a
staff, we can record absolute pitch levels--the descent of "g" to "e".)
 
 Both 'puncta' and 'producta' also seem to have an impact on duration, which I think should be clearly separated from
pitch. Is there any way to separate the duration implications out from them? If we remove duration from the meaning of
the sign (and encode it in a separate attribute), are 'punctus' and 'productus' effectively the same thing? 
   
  ****We would still differentiate between punctus and producta to reflect the sign the scribe used (for our visual
domain). Yes, I think we absolutely should record the duration implications separately, because some scribes used
"producta" as the standard sign for "lower" and "same or lower" pitches, while other scribes used "punctus" as the
standard and only used "producta" in special situations, to indicate lengthened duration. I think Thomas Weber was
considering suggesting the @dur attribute (data.DURATION.neumes) with the values "longer" and "shorter". 
  
 Is there a sign for 'same or higher with longer duration'? Is that necessary?
   
  **No, there's no basic sign for that. To show a higher pitch with longer duration, a scribe would add an episema to
the acuta, or add a significative letter "t" (tenere) next to the acuta. The proposal from Thomas Weber and me would
allow a significative letter element and using the @dur attribute (longer and shorter duration) to record the meaning of
the scribe's use of episema and significative letters.
 
 Is there a reason the 'neume' element has been replaced with 'ncg' in the supplied encoding?
   
  ***Yes! We are trying to make the Neumes Module revision comfortable for all musicologists. The term neume can mean
different things, depending on the context in which it is used, and the musicologist. Neume component grouping is
clearly a technical term, specific to the encoding, that will not cause confusion for chant scholars.
 
 Cheers!
 -Andrew
 
 > On 20 Sep 2017, at 16:55, Elaine Stratton Hild <elaine.stratton_hild at uni-wuerzburg.de> wrote:
 >
 > Dear All,
 >
 > Thank you for your work on this.
 >
 > I agree completely, Andrew, that the neume names should be able to be included in the encoding, but the encoding
should not depend on them. A quick thought concerning your suggestion below… “neume name” (rather than “neume type”
would probably be more specific and clearer to musicologists (like me > Just to clarify… the proposal Thomas Weber and I have put forward does not rely upon neume names. The designations we
recommend (“acuta” / “gravis” \ “punctus” . and “producta” _ ) are the earliest historical designations for notational
signs, and—most importantly—they are not limited to one notational type. (Perhaps this is along the lines of what you
meant with "data shapes", Andrew?)
 >
 > They designate basic shapes that themselves convey basic information (acuta = one note with the same or higher pitch;
gravis = one note with lower pitch; punctus = one note with same or lower pitch and normal duration; producta = one note
with same or lower pitch and longer duration).
 >
 > They are especially convenient for encoding because they can be combined to create all the notational signs of all
types medieval notation.
 >
 > (Small historical detour... For the writer of the 10th century treatise where these terms are first used for musical
notation, the signs formed binary oppositions to each other: “Acuta” and “gravis” were drawn from the study of grammar,
with the acuta placed over vowels where the voice rose in pitch and the gravis placed with syllables where the voice
fell in pitch. “Punctus” and “producta” are symbols drawn from verse analysis: short syllables in Latin were marked with
punctus; long syllables were marked with producta.)
 >
 > We suggest using these designations (as basic "data shapes"), rather than the tilt attribute, because the basic
meaning conveyed by an acuta (the logical domain) remains consistent across all medieval notations, but the nuanced tilt
of the sign (the visual domain, whether it’s written “north” or “northeast”, for example) varies with individual
scribes.
 >
 > Many thanks and all best wishes,
 > Elaine
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 > Dr. Elaine Stratton Hild
 > Corpus monodicum: Die einstimmige Musik des lateinischen Mittelalters
 > Julius-Maximilians-Universität Würzburg
 > Institut für Musikforschung
 > Domerschulstraße 13
 > D-97070 Würzburg
 >
 >
 > >>> Andrew Hankinson <andrew.hankinson at mail.mcgill.ca> 09/20/17 4:58 PM >>>
 > Hi Thomas,
 >
 > Thanks for this, and spending time putting forward some concrete suggestions.
 >
 > I'm also of the opinion that the current proposal has a significant bias towards the visual component. I believe this
has emerged largely because the exact musical content of some repertoires is unknown, making a system built on a
"logical" domain approach to musical description difficult to define. (that is, when all you have a symbol that is
angled, and you don't even know what pitch it is, how do you describe it musically?) That said, I think it's worthwhile
to try and tug the existing proposal in the direction of addressing and describing the musical content directly.
 >
 > I have been under the impression that building a system built on explicit naming of neumes as elements would not be a
good idea, based on critiques I have heard on the existing neume module. The same neume can have many names (across
styles or languages) and building a system on neume names makes it more difficult to accurately capture the longer
non-standard (i.e., "compound") neumes. Thus the reason for building a system based on shape contour, rather than shape
name.
 >
 > That isn't to say that names are not a valuable thing to encode, but the idea is that these names would be included
in a separate taxonomy within the file (or even a separate controlled vocabulary) that might be referenced within an
encoding. I think this will go further towards making a general encoding system for all neumed repertoires, instead of
narrowing it down to a particular style.
 >
 > You might imagine something along the lines of:
 >
 > <neume type="#clivis">
 > ...
 > </neume>
 >
 > or
 >
 > <neume type="http://example.org/neumevocabulary#clivis">
 > ...
 > </neume>
 >
 > This would let you use your own controlled vocabulary to name things for your own encoding, while maintaining general 'data shape' for the musical structures, allowing them to be compared across repertoires.
 >
 > -Andrew
 >
 > > On 20 Sep 2017, at 15:26, Thomas Weber <thomas.weber at notengrafik.com> wrote:
 > >
 > > Dear group,
 > >
 > >
 > > Elaine and me looked at both the Hildegard example as well as the "standard" neumes table by Cardine and made an
attempt at encoding the signs' properties with better separation of domains. We tried to add more logical domain
information to the previously mostly graphical domain info.
 > >
 > > Our thesis was that the main distinguishing factor between different use cases of the Neumes module is in how much
detail the notation should be described. Many projects right now use the Volpiano font to capture only the melodic
contour and potentially connection information. For Corpus monodicum, we want to encode more properties of single
staff-bound components, mainly whether a component is an oriscus, quilisma or strophicus. Our understanding is that the
Old Hispanic project as well as the Optical Neumes Recognition project need even more detailed information to be
encodable.
 > >
 > > We came to the conclusion that the problem we still need to solve is better separation of visual and logical
domains. Our impression is that the visual domain is of primary importance for both of the named projects. That might be
the reason why the current draft seems to mainly focus on the visual domain.
 > >
 > > We prepared the following table based on Cardine that outlines our suggested encoding.
 > >
 > > http://cm.notengrafik.com/2017-Graz-Cantus-Newtork/cardine-table/cardine_web.xml
 > >
 > > The most obvious addition are sub-elements describing each <nc> as one of the seven basic single pitch signs (four
basic signs based on Anonymus Vaticanus: acuta, gravis, punctus, producta; three special signs: quilisma, oriscus,
strophicus). We chose to make them elements so that each of those can get its specific set of attributes describing them
in more detail, like "extended" for acuta/gravis (understood to indicate larger intervals) or "waves" for quilisma. The
idea behind that was to make it clearer which attributes are usable in which contexts, but this could also be done by
means of Schematron rules when using attributes instead of elements - which we did in our pre-Graz state of ideas:
 > >
 > > http://cm.notengrafik.com/2017-Graz-Cantus-Network/presentation/presentation.html#variations
 > > http://cm.notengrafik.com/2017-Graz-Cantus-Network/presentation/presentation.html#code-sign
 > >
 > > We suggest to represent the "angled" property using the @con attribute, as "angularity" is a property of the
connection. Depending on the sign, the logical meaning of this would be to lengthen the component before or after the
angled connection. This logical domain info could be recorded using @dur on the proper <nc>.
 > >
 > > We picked up Ich's encoding of "O splendidissima" and made a modified version here:
 > >
 > > http://cm.notengrafik.com/2017-Graz-Cantus-Network/O_splindidissima.mei
 > >
 > > Here we also tried to illustrate how more detailed visual domain information could added, namely the suggested
@tilt. As the tilt is in most cases a consistent scribal idiosyncrasy, this might however better be solved using the
tables of signs that Stefan Morent reminded us of recently. There, these idiosyncrasies could be described once for an
entire file, source or hand. Johannes (hi to Johannes in CC) suggested that these "standard" patterns of writing might
be best put in <scoreDef> and to encode deviations where they occur. These tables could also be useful to document
variation among tokens.
 > >
 > > We suggest to keep the table problem and how to link between the content and the tables (by semi-standardized
names, by project specific naming/numbering schemes or by simple XML IDs, or maybe implicitly by characteristic sequence
of single pitch signs) for later discussion, together with other topics like how to represent mi signs and rubrics.
 > >
 > > We wish you a fruitful workshop in Halifax, and we are looking forward to hearing about any outcome concerning the
neumes module!
 > > Thomas
 > >
 > >
 > > Am 07.09.2017 um 14:57 schrieb Ichiro Fujinaga, Prof.:
 > >> Here’s what I have for the draft of the proposal for the new MEI Neumes Module schema.
 > >> I’ve arbitrarily named it Version 0.2, so that we can refer back to it.
 > >>
 > >> For ease of discussion and efficiency, please discuss one issue at a time in separate email threads, e.g., Re:
@oriscus.
 > >>
 > >> Thanks,
 > >>
 > >> Ichiro
 > >>
 > >> ==============================
 > >> MEI Neumes Module Draft, Version 0.2
 > >>
 > >> A <neume> element consists of one or more <nc> element(s).
 > >>
 > >> A <nc> (neume component) is a single pitched event, although the exact pitch may not be known.
 > >>
 > >> Attributes for <neume>:
 > >> @intm (interval melodic; relative to the previous <neume>) {u|d|s|n|sh|sl} (u = up/high, d = down/low, s = same, n
= neutral/unknown, sh = same or higher (but not lower), sl = same or lower (but not higher))
 > >> @significative letters
 > >> @hispanicTick (type1, type2)
 > >> @hook
 > >>
 > >> Attributes for <nc>:
 > >> @pname
 > >> @oct
 > >> @intm (interval melodic; relative to the previous <neume>) {u|d|s|n|sh|sl} (u = up, d = down, s = same, n =
neutral/unknown, sh = same or higher (but not lower), sl = same or lower (but not higher))
 > >> @wavy
 > >> @significative letters
 > >> @curved (anticlockwise, clockwise)
 > >> @angular (plain, v-shaped, staircase) (was @angled)
 > >> @liquescence
 > >> @episema
 > >> @extended
 > >> @tilt {n|ne|e|se|s|sw|w|ne} (north, northeast, etc.)
 > >> @quilisma (2, 3, or 4 curves)
 > >> @oriscus (curved, flat, jagged)
 > >> @con (gapped, looped) (connection to the previous <nc> within the same <neume>)
 > >>
 > >> Removed from the previous version: @jagged, @flat, @long, @diagonalright, and @hispanicLoop from the <neume>
level.
 > >>
 > >> _______________________________________________
 > >> mei-neumes-ig mailing list
 > >>
 > >> mei-neumes-ig at lists.uni-paderborn.de
 > >> https://lists.uni-paderborn.de/mailman/listinfo/mei-neumes-ig
 > >
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 ----- Ende der Nachricht von Elaine Stratton Hild <elaine.stratton_hild at uni-wuerzburg.de> -----
 
  

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