[MEI-L] repeat start and stop

Fri Oct 22 15:57:02 CEST 2010

Am 22.10.2010 um 15:53 schrieb Roland, Perry (pdr4h):

> Johannes,
> 
> It would be semantically correct to keep the information in both places with the proper switch in perspective; that is, 
> 
> <measure n="4" right="rptstart"/>
> <measure n="5" left="rptstart"/>
> 
> I don't think we should be too concerned with values that don't agree -- in fact, it may be entirely necessary.  For example, when m. 4 is at the end of a line, it's right barline may be a double one (to indicate the end of a 4-measure intro.), but the left barline of m. 5 will then carry the rptstart value.
> 

Good point. Hadn't thought about that. But we should have better documentation on this…

> --
> p.
> 
> __________________________
> Perry Roland
> Digital Curation Services
> University of Virginia Library
> P. O. Box 400155
> Charlottesville, VA 22904-4155
> 434-982-2702 (w)
> pdr4h at virginia.edu
> ________________________________________
> From: mei-l-bounces at lists.uni-paderborn.de [mei-l-bounces at lists.uni-paderborn.de] On Behalf Of Johannes Kepper [kepper at edirom.de]
> Sent: Friday, October 22, 2010 9:43 AM
> To: Music Encoding Initiative
> Subject: Re: [MEI-L] repeat start and stop
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> thanks for your answers so far. They are very close to what we discussed this morning. But another question arises from that: How do these attributes relate to each other? Would it be semantically correct to keep the information on both places? What's happening if they have different values? Does
> 
>        <measure n="4" right="rptend"/>
>        <measure n="5" left="rptstart"/>
> 
> equal
> 
>        <measure n="4" right="rptboth"/>?
> 
> If so, what about
> 
>        <measure n="4" right="dotted"/>
>        <measure n="5" left="dashed"/>?
> 
> Should we add some Schematron rules to allow only semantically possible combinations? Or would we be too restrictive then, cutting flexibility needed for weird cases?
> 
> 
> Johannes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Am 22.10.2010 um 15:32 schrieb Roland, Perry (pdr4h):
> 
>> Hi everyone,
>> 
>> This is a case where correct representation can conflict with practicalities.  While it makes sense representationally to say that m.5 "contains/has" the left repeat sign, it is often the case that rendering software needs to know this fact one measure earlier in order to make decisions about layout.  So,
>> 
>> <measure n="4" right="rptstart"/>
>> 
>> may be easier to render without additional transformation than
>> 
>> <measure n="5" left="rptstart"/>
>> 
>> That being said, I'd still use the latter encoding because it follows more closely how musicians tend to read the notation.  The MEI -> Mup encoding can handle both options so it really doesn't matter which you use as long as you intend to use that transformation for rendering.  In either case, the documentation could/should be improved.
>> 
>> --
>> p.
>> 
>> __________________________
>> Perry Roland
>> Digital Curation Services
>> University of Virginia Library
>> P. O. Box 400155
>> Charlottesville, VA 22904-4155
>> 434-982-2702 (w)
>> pdr4h at virginia.edu
>> ________________________________________
>> From: mei-l-bounces at lists.uni-paderborn.de [mei-l-bounces at lists.uni-paderborn.de] On Behalf Of Christine Siegert [siegert at udk-berlin.de]
>> Sent: Friday, October 22, 2010 3:57 AM
>> To: Music Encoding Initiative
>> Subject: Re: [MEI-L] repeat start and stop
>> 
>> Dear List,
>> in my opinion, Johannes and Maja are right. The repetition should be incoded
>> as being part of bar 5, simply because it is part of bar 5. The other
>> encoding would represent only the place, but not the meaning of the sign.
>> Best wishes,
>> Christine
>> 
>> 
>> Prof. Dr. Christine Siegert
>> Universität der Künste Berlin
>> Musikwissenschaft, Fakultät Musik
>> Fasanenstr. 1B, D-10623 Berlin
>> 
>> Postanschrift: Postfach 12 05 44, D-10595 Berlin
>> Tel.: +49 (0)30-3185-2318
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Maja Hartwig" <Maja.Hartwig at gmx.de>
>> To: <mei-l at lists.uni-paderborn.de>
>> Sent: Friday, October 22, 2010 9:38 AM
>> Subject: [MEI-L] repeat start and stop
>> 
>> 
>>> Dear List,
>>> 
>>> don't wonder about the mail address, this is Johannes sitting together
>>> with Maja Hartwig, one of our new MEI contributors here in Detmold. We
>>> have discovered a slight inconsistency regarding the best practice of
>>> encoding repetition signs.
>>> 
>>> Here's the situation: We have a repetition starting in measure 5. In the
>>> Tag Library, it is recommended to always use only the @right attribute of
>>> a measure to encode such information, leaving the @left only "for
>>> facilitation of translation from legacy encodings which use it." If taken
>>> serious, this means that in measure 4 we say that a repetition starts in
>>> the following measure, although this measure 4 is in no way affected by
>>> it. Isn't this a little bit awkward, especially for processing? What's the
>>> best practice for this, any experiences or feelings anyone?
>>> 
>>> Thanks and best regards,
>>> Maja and Johannes
>>> --
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>> 
>> 
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