From ried-musikforschung at mail.de  Fri Dec  1 15:06:07 2017
From: ried-musikforschung at mail.de (Dennis Ried)
Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2017 15:06:07 +0100
Subject: [mei-catalog-ig] stamps and paper notes
Message-ID: <148BDDD1-B011-4B16-82C1-CEBA8767ABFD@mail.de>

Dear List,

for my master thesis I tried to create a concept for a MEI based catalogue of works of an unkown german composer. Now for my PhD thesis I try to apply that idea.
I'm using the MEI header to collect all the metadata around the sources.

During the autopsy of the sources I noticed that there are a lot of stamps but there is no place in the MEI header where I can put it in the way I need it. At the moment I stored it at the <noteStmt> element as an annotation:

<notesStmt>
    <annot type="stamp" label="S" corresp="#ID-of-physMedium">L.B. Karlsruhe (1r)</annot>
</notesStmt>

(@label="S" -> at the moment: cardinal direction of the position on the paper)

Yes, this is a place where it can be I think but for example watermarks there exists an own element, so why not also for stamps?
The reason why I try to keep that information is that the stamps are important for research on the history of the source.

The same problem I have concerning paper notes (or paper marks? I'm sorry if this is not the best translation). These notes printed by the producer can for example help to date the sources so in my project I need to save them. Also for these notes I try to find a "better" place than <noteStmt>.

So my question is: Are there some ideas where to keep that kind of information?

One last comment: I know that there is an element in TEI (<tei:stamp>) I could implement but because I am describing musical sources I would like to check out all the possibilities of <meiHead> first.

Best regards
Dennis Ried
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From pdr4h at virginia.edu  Fri Dec  1 19:48:57 2017
From: pdr4h at virginia.edu (Roland, Perry D. (pdr4h))
Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2017 18:48:57 +0000
Subject: [mei-catalog-ig] stamps and paper notes
In-Reply-To: <148BDDD1-B011-4B16-82C1-CEBA8767ABFD@mail.de>
References: <148BDDD1-B011-4B16-82C1-CEBA8767ABFD@mail.de>
Message-ID: <BN6PR13MB15544D5B5B901C51EA932DBB9F390@BN6PR13MB1554.namprd13.prod.outlook.com>


Hi Dennis,

I'm pleased to hear that you've chosen to use MEI for your PhD.

Without extending MEI, the <notesStmt> is currently the best place to put such information, since it's a kind of "catch-all" for data that doesn't fit better somewhere else.  I don't think that using @label is the best way to record physical details about the stamp, though.  Since @type can take multiple values and one could say that orientation is a way of typing stamps, it would be better to use it instead of @label, e.g.,

<notesStmt>
  <annot type="stamp south-oriented" corresp="#ID-of-physMedium">L.B. Karlsruhe (1r)<annot>
</notesStmt>

@type allows one to create an "ad hoc" taxonomy, but you might also consider creating a formal one for stamps, if one doesn't exist already.  If you decide to go in that direction, then annot/@class could be used to point into the taxonomy, either stored in the MEI header or elsewhere on the Internet.

I want to take this opportunity to say that your question has come at an opportune moment.  Since there seems to have been substantial interest at the recent metadata meeting in Mainz in capturing more physical details of manuscript material, in the last couple of weeks I've been working on a proposal for doing just that.  The attached ODD file describes a new MEI.msdesc module as well as some changes to existing MEI features.  It incorporates a number of elements defined by TEI, including <stamp>.  The proposed changes would permit the use of something like -- 

<stamp>
  <locus>1r</locus>
  <fig>
    <figDesc><quote>L.B. Karlsruhe</quote></figDesc>
  </fig>
</stamp>

(Without additional changes, likely to be complex and far-reaching, <quote> isn't allowed directly in <stamp>.)

By "paper notes", I'm guessing you mean "chain" and "laid" lines created during the paper-making process.  These details aren't directly addressed in the current proposal, but could be described using physMedium/supportDesc/support.

Of course, this is very much a "work-in-progress" and will require further discussion and testing, mostly about the way that description of the component parts of manuscripts interact with FRBR.  I hope that members of this list will contribute to the development of this new module by commenting here or on the music-encoding Github repository issues page.  (I haven't created an issue yet, but will soon.)  

In the meantime, if you're interested in testing out the MEI manuscript description module or just adding <stamp> to <physDesc> as a short-term fix for your planned PhD work, we can talk more about that off-line.

Best wishes,

--
p.

_________________________________________
Perry Roland
Manuscripts Metadata Migration Project Manager
University of Virginia Library
P. O. Box 400108
Charlottesville, VA 22904-4104
434-982-2702 (w)
pdr4h (at) virginia (dot) edu


> -----Original Message-----
> From: mei-catalog-ig [mailto:mei-catalog-ig-bounces at lists.uni-paderborn.de] On Behalf
> Of Dennis Ried
> Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:06 AM
> To: mei-catalog-ig at lists.uni-paderborn.de
> Subject: [mei-catalog-ig] stamps and paper notes
> 
> Dear List,
> 
> for my master thesis I tried to create a concept for a MEI based catalogue of works of an
> unkown german composer. Now for my PhD thesis I try to apply that idea.
> I'm using the MEI header to collect all the metadata around the sources.
> 
> During the autopsy of the sources I noticed that there are a lot of stamps but there is no
> place in the MEI header where I can put it in the way I need it. At the moment I stored it at
> the <noteStmt> element as an annotation:
> 
> <notesStmt>
>     <annot type="stamp" label="S" corresp="#ID-of-physMedium">L.B. Karlsruhe
> (1r)</annot> </notesStmt>
> 
> (@label="S" -> at the moment: cardinal direction of the position on the paper)
> 
> Yes, this is a place where it can be I think but for example watermarks there exists an own
> element, so why not also for stamps?
> The reason why I try to keep that information is that the stamps are important for research
> on the history of the source.
> 
> The same problem I have concerning paper notes (or paper marks? I'm sorry if this is not
> the best translation). These notes printed by the producer can for example help to date the
> sources so in my project I need to save them. Also for these notes I try to find a "better"
> place than <noteStmt>.
> 
> So my question is: Are there some ideas where to keep that kind of information?
> 
> One last comment: I know that there is an element in TEI (<tei:stamp>) I could implement
> but because I am describing musical sources I would like to check out all the possibilities
> of <meiHead> first.
> 
> Best regards
> Dennis Ried
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From pdr4h at virginia.edu  Mon Dec 18 21:47:04 2017
From: pdr4h at virginia.edu (Roland, Perry D. (pdr4h))
Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2017 20:47:04 +0000
Subject: [mei-catalog-ig] Better description of manuscript material
Message-ID: <BN6PR13MB15548CFC41C6B1886363F7C79F0E0@BN6PR13MB1554.namprd13.prod.outlook.com>


Hello,

I've posted an update of my plan to provide enhanced description of "manuscript", i.e., non-print, material in MEI at https://github.com/music-encoding/music-encoding/issues/489.  I'm eager to get reactions from this group, so please attach questions and comments there.  Silence will be taken as tacit approval.  :)

Thanks,

--
p.

_________________________________________
Perry Roland
Manuscripts Metadata Migration Project Manager
University of Virginia Library
P. O. Box 400108
Charlottesville, VA 22904-4104
434-982-2702 (w)
pdr4h (at) virginia (dot) edu

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