<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class="">Sibelius positions it within its own timing system, which gives you (in a measure of 4/4) 1024 positions. However, most often than not the lines are tied to a note, which is at a specific position. <div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I've got a process that tries to find the nearest note to a given position, and then uses that for the start/end IDs. Failing that, it will record @tstamp/@tstamp2 for start/end relative to the measure/staff/layer. It will also record the @dur.ges, just to store the "performed" duration from Sibelius (e.g., dur.ges="256p" would mean that the duration is a quarter-note in Sibelius ticks).</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">So @tstamp/@tstamp2 and @staff/@layer are the most critical parts of ensuring we can preserve the location of the note, beyond @start/end id.</div><div class=""><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Sep 30, 2015, at 5:49 PM, Roland, Perry D. (pdr4h) <<a href="mailto:pdr4h@eservices.virginia.edu" class="">pdr4h@eservices.virginia.edu</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1; font-family: SourceCodePro-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Ok, but are @startid and @endid sufficient? How does Sibelius position the line?<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">--<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">p.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="border-style: none none none solid; border-left-color: blue; border-left-width: 1.5pt; padding: 0in 0in 0in 4pt;" class=""><div class=""><div style="border-style: solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;" class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class="">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class=""><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>mei-l [<a href="mailto:mei-l-bounces@lists.uni-paderborn.de" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">mailto:mei-l-bounces@lists.uni-paderborn.de</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="">On Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Andrew Hankinson<br class=""><b class="">Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Wednesday, September 30, 2015 5:42 PM<br class=""><b class="">To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Music Encoding Initiative<br class=""><b class="">Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [MEI-L] Bracketed Lines in MEI<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">No, I'm not using any of those particular attributes since I can't really extract those from the Sibelius original.<o:p class=""></o:p></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">I will go ahead and create a pull request that adds these attributes to line. <o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">Thanks!<o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div><div class=""><blockquote style="margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;" class=""><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">On Sep 30, 2015, at 5:35 PM, Roland, Perry D. (pdr4h) <<a href="mailto:pdr4h@eservices.virginia.edu" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">pdr4h@eservices.virginia.edu</a>> wrote:<o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div><div class=""><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Line is the appropriate entity. I can hear the sighs now, but the ligature element in MEI is not intended for these brackets – “The ligature element should not be used for brackets in modern notation that indicate notes that were part of a ligature in the original source.” (from the description of ligature in the schema) and so it’s currently in the MEI.mensural module – it disappears when MEI.mensural is not invoked. Creation of a similar entity for CMN or merging of ligatures in both repertoires is a possibility, but the topic needs discussion.</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Currently, a line can only be positioned relative to the objects referenced by its @startid and @endid attributes using @start(ho|to|vo) and @end(ho|to|vo). But, I don’t think there’s any reason not to allow @tstamp, @tstamp2, @staff, @layer and @place. Even so, I think the best (that is, most precise) way to position lines is by associating them with specific events or time stamps. The @staff, @layer, @place attributes can only be useful for making sure the lines associated with a particular staff are considered when processing that staff’s data, for instance when rendering a single staff (e.g., part extraction).</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">In any case,have a look at the mei-all_anyStart.odd in /develop-perry. Line has undergone some significant changes. Its new attributes:</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">form: dashed, dotted, solid, wavy</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">width: narrow, medium, wide, or numeric value + unit (cm|mm|in|pt|pc|px|vu)</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">endsym: angledown -- 90 degree turn down (similar to Unicode 231D at end of line, 231C at start).</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div style="margin-left: 0.5in;" class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-indent: 0.5in;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">angleup -- 90 degree turn up (similar to Unicode 231F at end of line, 231E at start)</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div style="margin-left: 0.5in;" class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-indent: 0.5in;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">angleright -- 90 degree turn right (syntactic sugar for "angledown" for vertical or angled lines).</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div style="margin-left: 0.5in;" class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-indent: 0.5in;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">angleleft -- 90 degree turn left (syntactic sugar for "angleup" for vertical or angled lines).</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div style="margin-left: 0.5in;" class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-indent: 0.5in;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">arrow -- Filled, triangular arrowhead (similar to SMuFL U+EB78).</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div style="margin-left: 0.5in;" class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-indent: 0.5in;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">arrowopen -- Open triangular arrowhead (similar to SMuFL U+EB8A).</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div style="margin-left: 0.5in;" class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-indent: 0.5in;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">arrowwhite -- Unfilled, triangular arrowhead (similar to SMuFL U+EB82).</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div style="margin-left: 0.5in;" class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-indent: 0.5in;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">harpoonleft -- Harpoon-shaped arrowhead left of line (similar to arrowhead of Unicode U+21BD).</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div style="margin-left: 0.5in;" class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-indent: 0.5in;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">harpoonright -- Harpoon-shaped arrowhead right of line (similar to arrowhead of Unicode U+21BC).</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div style="margin-left: 0.5in;" class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; text-indent: 0.5in;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">none -- No start symbol.</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">endsymsize: 1-9 (relative size)</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">startsym: [same as endsym]</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">startsymsize: [same as endsym]</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Andrew, when you say you’re supporting MEI 3.0.0 in SibMEI, are you using these new attributes?</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">--</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">p.</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div style="border-style: none none none solid; border-left-color: blue; border-left-width: 1.5pt; padding: 0in 0in 0in 4pt;" class=""><div class=""><div style="border-style: solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;" class=""><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><b class=""><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class="">From:</span></b><span class="apple-converted-space"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class=""> </span></span><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class="">mei-l [<a href="mailto:mei-l-bounces@lists.uni-paderborn.de" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><span style="color: purple;" class="">mailto:mei-l-bounces@lists.uni-paderborn.de</span></a>]<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="">On Behalf Of<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Andrew Hankinson<br class=""><b class="">Sent:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Wednesday, September 30, 2015 4:42 PM<br class=""><b class="">To:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Music Encoding Initiative<br class=""><b class="">Subject:</b><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>[MEI-L] Bracketed Lines in MEI</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""> <o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">Hello all,<o:p class=""></o:p></div></div><div class=""><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""> <o:p class=""></o:p></div></div></div><div class=""><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">I'm looking at the following:<o:p class=""></o:p></div></div></div><div class=""><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""> <o:p class=""></o:p></div></div></div><div class=""><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><image001.png><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div></div><div class=""><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""> <o:p class=""></o:p></div></div></div><div class=""><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">It seems that the best element to use in this case would be 'line'; however, the line element currently does not support durational attributes (@dur, @dur.ges, @tstamp, @tstamp2) or positional (@staff, @layer, @place). <o:p class=""></o:p></div></div></div><div class=""><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""> <o:p class=""></o:p></div></div></div><div class=""><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">Is there a better element to use for this object, or should a modification be proposed for the schema?<o:p class=""></o:p></div></div></div><div class=""><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""> <o:p class=""></o:p></div></div></div><div class=""><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">Many thanks,<o:p class=""></o:p></div></div></div><div class=""><div class=""><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class="">-Andrew<o:p class=""></o:p></div></div></div></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: SourceCodePro-Regular, serif;" class="">_______________________________________________<br class="">mei-l mailing list<br class=""></span><a href="mailto:mei-l@lists.uni-paderborn.de" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><span style="font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: SourceCodePro-Regular, serif; color: purple;" class="">mei-l@lists.uni-paderborn.de</span></a><span style="font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: SourceCodePro-Regular, serif;" class=""><br class=""></span><a href="https://lists.uni-paderborn.de/mailman/listinfo/mei-l" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><span style="font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: SourceCodePro-Regular, serif; color: purple;" class="">https://lists.uni-paderborn.de/mailman/listinfo/mei-l</span></a><o:p class=""></o:p></div></div></blockquote></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></div></div></div></div><span style="font-family: SourceCodePro-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">_______________________________________________</span><br style="font-family: SourceCodePro-Regular; 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