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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=DE link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Because I have no idea how the size of a note is coded in MEI, I want t ask a question.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>In the attached file there is a small note (in this edition editorial addings are engraved as small notes) which HAS to be connected the the *normal* beam. I would no call that small note a grace note, but if the term *grace note* is the only way of encoding small notes, it would be good to be able to connect them to *normal* beams.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Only a thought of an unknowing engraver </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:#1F497D'>J</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Frank <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'>---<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'>NOTENSATZ LITTERSCHEID<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'>Frank Litterscheid<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'>Am Kuhkamp 7<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'>37619 Hehlen<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'>Tel 05533 - 979733<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'>Fax 05533 - 979732<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'>litterscheid@notensatz.biz<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Von:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> mei-l-bounces@lists.uni-paderborn.de [mailto:mei-l-bounces@lists.uni-paderborn.de] <b>Im Auftrag von </b>TW<br><b>Gesendet:</b> Sonntag, 14. April 2013 12:52<br><b>An:</b> Music Encoding Initiative<br><b>Betreff:</b> Re: [MEI-L] graceful beams<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>So, to what conclusion do we come? I think MEI doesn't lack any features here, it should just be made clear at a more prominent place in the specification/documented that grace notes will graphically not be part of a beam, even if they occur within the <beam> element. If you *really* want grace notes to be part of the regular beam, you can still achieve this using existing means.<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal>Is this a valid summary of the discussion?<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal>Thomas<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>2013/4/14 Roland, Perry (pdr4h) <<a href="mailto:pdr4h@eservices.virginia.edu" target="_blank">pdr4h@eservices.virginia.edu</a>><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p><span style='font-family:"Arial Unicode MS","sans-serif"'>Hi Don,<br><br>Thanks for joining the discussion.<br><br>I should've been wary of using the word "never". That's a dangerous word when it comes to music notation. (Note to self: Always avoid the words "always" and "never". Never use them.) Chopin's notation is usually pretty "slippery", so I'm not surprised you found evidence there to trip up the unsuspecting.<br><br>However, in both the Mozart and Chopin examples, the notes in question are clearly not part of the beamed group of "principal" notes. Stem direction is the best evidence. The different stem directions leading to the beams attached to the A# in the penultimate measure of the Chopin clearly indicate that there are two "layers/parts/streams/voices" here. There isn't just one A#, but two which occupy the same visual space. The big A# just obscures the little one. The grace note A# belongs to the upper layer while the regular note A# goes with the lower one. The same thing occurs on the B natural in the last measure. <br><br>Now that the part writing has been disentangled, what is most interesting is the *meaning* of this particular vertical alignment, the collision really, of a "principal" note and a "grace" note. What is Frederic trying to say? I believe he's indicating that the grace note arpeggio begins *with* the A#, not *after* it (this comports with Gould) and that the performer shouldn't rush getting to the A# at the top of the arpeggio. (By the way, I believe the sonic effect would've been the same if he'd simply written a wavy line in front of A#-C#-F#-A# in the right hand, just like what's in the left hand. But he made his choice and we have to live with it.)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span style='font-family:"Arial Unicode MS","sans-serif"'><br>There's an instance in the 3rd measure of the Chopin example that's more closely analogous to the situation in the Mozart that started the discussion: the grace notes between beat 2 and its second half (assuming this notation is counted in 2/4) lie under the beam connecting the G#-A-G# sequence, but they're not touching it. In addition, they're part of their own little beamed group. They are *logically excluded* from participating in the "big beam group" in spite of occurring between its participating notes, just like the grace notes in the Mozart example.<br><br>So, I stand by my assertion that grace notes are never (um, "extremely rarely") beamed with "regular" notes, where "beamed with" means "part of the same horizontal sequence as" normal-sized notes. Granted, I haven't seen the entire universe of music notation, but mixed grace- and normal-note beams are like unicorns -- I've heard talk of them, but as yet I haven't seen one. :-)<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial Unicode MS","sans-serif"'><br><br>--<br>p.<br><br>__________________________<br>Perry Roland<br>Music Library<br>University of Virginia<br>P. O. Box 400175<br>Charlottesville, VA 22904<br>434-982-2702 (w)<br>pdr4h (at) virginia (dot) edu<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>_______________________________________________<br>mei-l mailing list<br><a href="mailto:mei-l@lists.uni-paderborn.de">mei-l@lists.uni-paderborn.de</a><br><a href="https://lists.uni-paderborn.de/mailman/listinfo/mei-l" target="_blank">https://lists.uni-paderborn.de/mailman/listinfo/mei-l</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div></body></html>